Comments for Google Maps Bike There...for a safer, healthier, happier world. :-) http://googlemapsbikethere.org Thu, 24 Nov 2011 02:05:03 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 Comment on Your Local News Channel by Peter Smith http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/07/05/your-local-news-channel/comment-page-1/#comment-21435 Peter Smith Thu, 24 Nov 2011 02:05:03 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1602#comment-21435 Sub-human? wow. i thought it was pretty simple - i couldn't understand what he was saying, in part because he was behind this big thing that looked like a bazooka, and probably also because i was still waking up, and then i have my obvious anti-car disposition. don't think i really demonized anyone. Sub-human? wow. i thought it was pretty simple – i couldn’t understand what he was saying, in part because he was behind this big thing that looked like a bazooka, and probably also because i was still waking up, and then i have my obvious anti-car disposition. don’t think i really demonized anyone.

]]> Comment on Your Local News Channel by Kassandera http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/07/05/your-local-news-channel/comment-page-1/#comment-21430 Kassandera Thu, 24 Nov 2011 01:52:41 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1602#comment-21430 Great story, I love how cleverly you depict this guy. As if he were some sub-human species who you had to guess what he was trying to communicate with you. Absolutely hilarious example of miscommunication! Great story, I love how cleverly you depict this guy. As if he were some sub-human species who you had to guess what he was trying to communicate with you. Absolutely hilarious example of miscommunication!

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by Peter Smith http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16323 Peter Smith Fri, 19 Aug 2011 03:35:06 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16323 Chicago found 80% of pedestrians are struck in crosswalks. http://www.chicagotribune.com/classified/automotive/traffic/ct-met-getting-around-0815-20110815,0,2404951.column The article says the finding was surprising, but for those of us who follow these things, it's not surprising -- studies with similar numbers have been coming out for ages. Besides, where else would pedestrians be getting run down? Even anecdotally, anyone who has ever walked anywhere knows that walking into the street in a crosswalk is a stop-and-go situation -- you always have to be wary of outlaw drivers -- you always have to be ready to stop walking and even jump back. The question then, is do we: a) Ask pedestrians to stop using crosswalks?, b) Ask pedestrians to stop walking?, or c) Demand that drivers start obeying the law and stop injuring and killing people? I go with c), regardless of what the statistics might suggest about pedestrians 'getting themselves injured and killed'. Chicago found 80% of pedestrians are struck in crosswalks.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/classified/automotive/traffic/ct-met-getting-around-0815-20110815,0,2404951.column

The article says the finding was surprising, but for those of us who follow these things, it’s not surprising — studies with similar numbers have been coming out for ages.

Besides, where else would pedestrians be getting run down?

Even anecdotally, anyone who has ever walked anywhere knows that walking into the street in a crosswalk is a stop-and-go situation — you always have to be wary of outlaw drivers — you always have to be ready to stop walking and even jump back.

The question then, is do we:
a) Ask pedestrians to stop using crosswalks?,
b) Ask pedestrians to stop walking?, or
c) Demand that drivers start obeying the law and stop injuring and killing people?

I go with c), regardless of what the statistics might suggest about pedestrians ‘getting themselves injured and killed’.

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by Ed http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16297 Ed Thu, 18 Aug 2011 20:34:17 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16297 The city of Phoenix publishes what amounts to raw numbers of where cyclist-MB collisions occur. 70% of them occur "involving" (my term) sidewalk cycling -- that is to say in a driveway on the sidewalk, or in a crosswalk: http://azbikelaw.org/blog/listening-to-phoenixs-bicycle-collision-summary/ To actual arrive at risk-ratios and so forth, you would need exposure data, and also you would probably want to know severity outcomes -- neither of which are provided in the City data. The city of Phoenix publishes what amounts to raw numbers of where cyclist-MB collisions occur.
70% of them occur “involving” (my term) sidewalk cycling — that is to say in a driveway on the sidewalk, or in a crosswalk:

http://azbikelaw.org/blog/listening-to-phoenixs-bicycle-collision-summary/

To actual arrive at risk-ratios and so forth, you would need exposure data, and also you would probably want to know severity outcomes — neither of which are provided in the City data.

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by John Heylin (@norcalbeerguy) http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16127 John Heylin (@norcalbeerguy) Tue, 16 Aug 2011 18:24:33 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16127 As someone who has been hit by a sidewalk cyclist and suffered a minor concussion as a result (the guy took off after hitting me to boot), unless there is a specified bike lane on the sidewalk people should not ride their bikes on the sidewalk. It's too dangerous, especially near store fronts where people are constantly walking out and not expecting someone biking down the sidewalk. As someone who has been hit by a sidewalk cyclist and suffered a minor concussion as a result (the guy took off after hitting me to boot), unless there is a specified bike lane on the sidewalk people should not ride their bikes on the sidewalk. It’s too dangerous, especially near store fronts where people are constantly walking out and not expecting someone biking down the sidewalk.

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by Ryan http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16088 Ryan Tue, 16 Aug 2011 07:56:17 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16088 The problem is that in SF, cycling on sidewalks is illegal except on the Embarcadero. The other problem is that I've been hit by cyclists on the sidewalk before and this makes me angry to the point that I yell at them and stand my ground when they try to hit me. When they ring a bell behind me I will turn around and yell at them to get off the sidewalk. Don't like it? Change the law and then stop hitting pedestrians. The problem is that in SF, cycling on sidewalks is illegal except on the Embarcadero. The other problem is that I’ve been hit by cyclists on the sidewalk before and this makes me angry to the point that I yell at them and stand my ground when they try to hit me. When they ring a bell behind me I will turn around and yell at them to get off the sidewalk.

Don’t like it? Change the law and then stop hitting pedestrians.

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by Paul Johnson http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16070 Paul Johnson Tue, 16 Aug 2011 04:30:45 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16070 A cycletrack, such as the one pictured in Portland, is NOT a sidewalk, but another roadway. It rejoins the main roadway as a bicycle lane at each intersection giving cyclists the opportunity to merge left for left turns, and after the intersection enough room to merge right onto the track. It's designed to put cyclists in a visible spot at trouble points. It's not hugging the fenceline at driveways. To compare cycletracks to sidewalks is like comparing apples to hammers. A cycletrack, such as the one pictured in Portland, is NOT a sidewalk, but another roadway. It rejoins the main roadway as a bicycle lane at each intersection giving cyclists the opportunity to merge left for left turns, and after the intersection enough room to merge right onto the track. It’s designed to put cyclists in a visible spot at trouble points. It’s not hugging the fenceline at driveways. To compare cycletracks to sidewalks is like comparing apples to hammers.

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by John S, Allen http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16052 John S, Allen Tue, 16 Aug 2011 00:48:04 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16052 I've looked again and I've got to go at this again. Here's the full quote about crash risks from the Toronto study that both you and I cite. You cited only the first line. Please note the other two lines: "The rate of collision on off-road paths and sidewalks was lower than for roads. The relative rates for falls and injuries suggest these events are least common on-road followed by off-road paths, and finally most common on sidewalks. The rate of major injuries, an injury that required medical attention, was greatest on sidewalks and the difference between paths and sidewalks was negligible." You are cherry-picking your quotes, my friend. Yes, sidewalk riding can be safe but in almost all locations, that means riding hardly faster than pedestrian speed, and being highly-aware of the special hazards of sidewalk riding. The photo at the top of your post shows one of three cyclists riding squarely in the door zone of parked vehicles, and all of them heading for an intersection where those parked vehicles conceal them from turning motor traffic. I'll comment only on that and not on cycling conditions on the street to the left of those motor vehicles, there being nothing to go on in the photo. I’ve looked again and I’ve got to go at this again. Here’s the full quote about crash risks from the Toronto study that both you and I cite. You cited only the first line. Please note the other two lines:

“The rate of collision on off-road paths and sidewalks was lower than for roads. The relative rates for falls and injuries suggest these events are least common on-road followed by off-road paths, and finally most common on sidewalks. The rate of major injuries, an injury that required medical attention, was greatest on sidewalks and the difference between paths and sidewalks was negligible.”

You are cherry-picking your quotes, my friend.

Yes, sidewalk riding can be safe but in almost all locations, that means riding hardly faster than pedestrian speed, and being highly-aware of the special hazards of sidewalk riding.

The photo at the top of your post shows one of three cyclists riding squarely in the door zone of parked vehicles, and all of them heading for an intersection where those parked vehicles conceal them from turning motor traffic. I’ll comment only on that and not on cycling conditions on the street to the left of those motor vehicles, there being nothing to go on in the photo.

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by John S, Allen http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16051 John S, Allen Tue, 16 Aug 2011 00:34:26 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16051 Here's a sruvey of research on sidewalk safety, both European and North American. Can you come up with studies to contradict these? And if not, are you prepared to retract your statement about the safety of bicycling on sidewalks? http://bikexprt.com/bikepol/facil/sidepath/sidecrash.htm Here’s a sruvey of research on sidewalk safety, both European and North American. Can you come up with studies to contradict these? And if not, are you prepared to retract your statement about the safety of bicycling on sidewalks?

http://bikexprt.com/bikepol/facil/sidepath/sidecrash.htm

]]> Comment on In Praise of Sidewalk Cycling by John Schubert http://googlemapsbikethere.org/2011/08/12/in-praise-of-sidewalk-cycling/comment-page-1/#comment-16038 John Schubert Mon, 15 Aug 2011 21:48:02 +0000 http://googlemapsbikethere.org/?p=1629#comment-16038 Look at the excellent list of sidewalk riding hazards which DS posted. Do you really think Joe-just-riding-on-the-sidewalk is mindful of all of those? How can it be ethical to tell Joe "Sure, go ahead, and take risks you don't understand?" The research on what causes crashes fingers sidewalks two ways: statistically (counting the crashes and their locations) and functionally (analyzing the who-what-where of each individual crash, putting them into crash type categories, and adding up the categories). Look at the excellent list of sidewalk riding hazards which DS posted. Do you really think Joe-just-riding-on-the-sidewalk is mindful of all of those? How can it be ethical to tell Joe “Sure, go ahead, and take risks you don’t understand?”
The research on what causes crashes fingers sidewalks two ways: statistically (counting the crashes and their locations) and functionally (analyzing the who-what-where of each individual crash, putting them into crash type categories, and adding up the categories).

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